Shareholders Meeting

DaveC
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:14 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by DaveC » Thu Feb 08, 2018 7:49 pm

It seems to me the key figures are the significant losses (£295k 2016, £411k 2017) and as the shareholder funds are exhausted these losses and any future losses are effectively being covered by the Directors, either by issuing additional preference shares or by loans at 4% (which of course carry a risk if the Company folds). I doubt there was much if anything from player sales during the periods in question. I stand to be corrected should anyone have a different interpretation since, as has been said, abbreviated accounts do not carry much detail.

James E
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:56 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by James E » Thu Feb 08, 2018 8:32 pm

DaveC wrote:
Thu Feb 08, 2018 7:49 pm
It seems to me the key figures are the significant losses (£295k 2016, £411k 2017) and as the shareholder funds are exhausted these losses and any future losses are effectively being covered by the Directors, either by issuing additional preference shares or by loans at 4% (which of course carry a risk if the Company folds). I doubt there was much if anything from player sales during the periods in question. I stand to be corrected should anyone have a different interpretation since, as has been said, abbreviated accounts do not carry much detail.
The Figures of losses you quoted are aggregate, rather than annual. So there were total losses from the start of trading up to 30//6/17 of £411k, and therefore an annual loss of £116k for the year.

DaveC
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:14 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by DaveC » Thu Feb 08, 2018 9:00 pm

Thanks James, I should have said "at 2016" and "at 2017", sorry I think I made it look far worse than it appears!

Birdman
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:47 am
Location: Aldershot
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by Birdman » Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:55 am

The thing that concerns me is this. Is this debt controlled or are we on the slippery slope to repetition? I think that most of us on here have had (or still have) debt in the form of a mortgage and/or personal loan from a bank. These though are for an agreed period of time and for a fixed and regular repayment amount and one that the debtor adheres to. That is what I call a controlled debt. Uncontrolled debt (to me) is living outside of your means and having difficulty in getting things back under control.
I'm no businessman (never have been, never will be), and maybe they look on a degree of business debt as being ok so therefore, is this debt affordable? Some reassurances would be good or am I being too simplistic in my understanding of the situation?

Ancient Shot
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 7:30 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by Ancient Shot » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:29 am

As long as we stay friends with Metro Bank I can't see a problem

FloridaPhil
Posts: 25
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 9:37 am
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by FloridaPhil » Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:30 am

I don't understand anything to do with finances or business, so is what the club have submiited good?

James E
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:56 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by James E » Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:52 am

I think we need to bear in mind that the club has sold two players in the seven months since 30/6/17. It is quite possible that the Kanu transfer last July or August made good the £116k loss for 16/17. If not, then the combined fees for him and Bernard Mensah will have done so.

On the other hand, we can't guarantee to get £100k+ in transfer (or Cup) income every year.

Richard Petty
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:12 pm
Location: Farnborough
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by Richard Petty » Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:39 pm

FloridaPhil wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:30 am
I don't understand anything to do with finances or business, so is what the club have submiited good?
Taking into account the unexpected cost during the 2016/2016 accounting year of putting the players onto a 52 week contract in order to retain them for this season (the whole of that cost is in these accounts) and if you include the Amortisation plus all the set up costs for the new Acadamy then I would say the answer to your question is yes pretty good, not as perfect as a profit or a break even would be of course but certainly reassuring.

The big plus for me was seeing the increase in income being generated, if that level of income is maintained or even increased then unless something unexpected occurs this year then I would expect to see us at or very near a break even for the 2017/2018 year.

Its also good to see that from what we read and hear about other clubs running costs ours continue to be tightly managed and that for me is the key to stability. It was losing control of costs through most of 2012 and into 2013 that got the club into the mire. During that period we had a good income level but the costs were just too much for the club to bear.

DaveC
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:14 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by DaveC » Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:50 pm

Sorry Richard, I am probably being thick but I can't see any figures for the income anywhere in the document.

abee
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:03 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by abee » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:47 pm

DaveC wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:50 pm
Sorry Richard, I am probably being thick but I can't see any figures for the income anywhere in the document.
Nor can I and perhaps Richard will reference this for us so that we may follow his point exactly.

I tend to be of the 'Turnover is vanity, cash is sanity' school but when Richard refers us to the 2016 and 2017 turnovers (and I assume that perhaps the shareholders were provided with a more detailed document) then we can return to this.

bordon shot
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:13 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by bordon shot » Fri Feb 09, 2018 5:43 pm

Birdman wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:55 am
The thing that concerns me is this. Is this debt controlled or are we on the slippery slope to repetition? I think that most of us on here have had (or still have) debt in the form of a mortgage and/or personal loan from a bank. These though are for an agreed period of time and for a fixed and regular repayment amount and one that the debtor adheres to. That is what I call a controlled debt. Uncontrolled debt (to me) is living outside of your means and having difficulty in getting things back under control.
I'm no businessman (never have been, never will be), and maybe they look on a degree of business debt as being ok so therefore, is this debt affordable? Some reassurances would be good or am I being too simplistic in my understanding of the situation?
Well put Birdman, I have the same concerns for the same reasons. A lot of us may not be shareholders but we are supporters never the less, it would be nice for the BOD to make a statement of club accounts to, 1 - be upfront & honest & 2, put our minds at rest.

dalinz
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:26 pm
Location: Guildford
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by dalinz » Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:06 pm

Ancient Shot wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 8:29 am
As long as we stay friends with Metro Bank I can't see a problem
And the Tax Man. He seems to do the most damage.

Richard Petty
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:12 pm
Location: Farnborough
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by Richard Petty » Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:13 pm

We had the same set of figures so apologies for giving a false impression in my earlier post that they are shown in there. What I based my post on was that there was discussion during the AGM over the accounts and it was confirmed that the improved position of the club financially was largely due to (Quote) "An impressive 50% increase in turnover".

Getting Gary Waddock back resulting in the better than previously experienced performance on the pitch will have helped greatly with improved attendances and of course a bit more interest from sponsors to spend a little more which it seems the club has maximised as best they can.

abee is correct though that turnover is vanity and profit is sanity however when the turnover is not matched by an equal increase in costs then that is indeed the sanity that we are looking for.

Having shares even just £100 worth which is all I have at the moment does give you the chance to go to the Shareholders meeting and ask questions and you do get very open answers. I can understand why many who had shares in the old company might have been a bit reluctant to buy again when the current company launched but that's nearly 5 years ago so could be worth thinking about again. Something that I had a thought on is that a lot of people have donated to the 500 club which if we get promotion gives you an extra £100 back but maybe instead of taking the profit and just having a good night out on it perhaps it could be worth buying £100 worth of shares instead. That way you own a little bit of the club again and get to come to the shareholders meeting next year.

Tiger131
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri May 08, 2015 12:20 pm
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by Tiger131 » Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:27 pm

How do you go about buying shares?

Richard Petty
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:12 pm
Location: Farnborough
Re: Shareholders Meeting

Post by Richard Petty » Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:45 pm

Tiger131 wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:27 pm
How do you go about buying shares?
Good question, there is some legal reason, details of which I cant recall exactly that prohibits certain types of company (we are one) from advertising the sale of shares, the purchase has to be requested by the buyer. That does seem a daft law to me as it means the club cant put anything on the website which doesn't help people to buy them.

Not sure who deals with share purchases now but in the first instance I would suggest either a call to the club during the week or an email to admin@theshots.co.uk


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