O/t Great British Railway Journeys

redblueuptoyou
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by redblueuptoyou » Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:55 am

Fuggletim wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:47 am
Very seldom when the Railway is featured on TV and film is it technically accurate. For example, the programme last night was switching from shots of 4 x track, double track and single track locations despite the entire journey being made would only have been over a double track. Being in the rail industry, I do smile (and groan) a lot when I see the Railway portrayed on celluloid at the lack of accuracy.

One film that springs to mind is the "Elephant Man" which has a beautiful Victorian feel until a railway scene where suddenly a locomotive built in the late 1940's appears! Another one is the film "Quadrophenia" which uses a very obvious London Paddington as the location where "Jimmy" boards the train to Brighton instead of London Victoria and in the same film shows a mid 1970s High Speed Train passing his house, despite the film being set in 1963! Mind you the album "Quadrophenia" shows, in the booklet, the character Jimmy entering London Waterloo to make his fateful journey to Brighton, but at least he could have changed at Clapham Jct to get there; a lot easier than going from London Paddington!

I think, though, that if you ever see your own area of work or expertise portrayed on Film/TV you will often feel the same when it comes to technical accuracy. 😆
For a more modern reference, in one of the Thor films he gets on the Tube and asks how to get to Greenwich from a line that doesn’t get there.

Isn’t Portillo following old railway routes that are no longer in existence? Might be why he goes to these places.

Birdman
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Birdman » Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:34 am

supershots wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:26 am
I find it funny that nobody mentions on here that Portillo planned to go from Guildford to Chilworth then to Farnham?

Strange that he did not share that there is no link between the two! And tomorrow he will go from Farnborough to Winchester, somehow calling in at the Watercress line on the way!
I always enjoy the series but these episodes have shown up the artistic license which calls into question the other episodes.
At the time of my opening post, Kevin Carlin’s link and in yesterday’s Daily Mail tv page it was shown as Guildford to Aldershot. There was no mention of the route that he was going to take. I think that it was just our assumptions that it was going to be G’ford —-> A’shot direct.

Re the mention on p1 of the ‘Tongham ghost’, let’s not forget the legendary *’Tongham Treacle Mines’ either.


*one for us slightly older supporters methinks. :D

karlready
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by karlready » Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:35 pm

Lived on the edge of Tongham in the 50’s and 60’s, and the legend of the ghost train was a hot topic. There was a footbridge at the end of Spoil Lane in Tongham, taking pedestrians across the track into Cardinals estate. I can remember as a teenager mass gatherings on this bridge, on dark nights ,waiting for the train that never arrived.
There were at that time, up until 1964, still coal trains using the line, but only through an abandoned Tongham station, and up the spur to the Aldershot gas works. I have some photos somewhere, but I can’t find them, including the last train before closure, and the (signed!) photo of the driver, from Guildford depot.
The gas-works spur is now some of the footpath through Tongham woods.

Statto
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Statto » Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:32 pm

Fuggletim wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:01 pm
lowerbourneshot wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:19 pm
Fuggletim wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 5:24 pm
Wonder if he can find Ash Junction?
Or any remains of Tongham Halt Station.
Indeed! I remember it being there and with track still in situ in the mid 1960s although trains had ceased running long before. Think the bridge was still there until about 25 x years ago!

Oddly enough my Daughter lives in Tongham!
Where did the bridge go from/to?

Birdman
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Birdman » Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:46 pm

Statto wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:32 pm
Fuggletim wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:01 pm
lowerbourneshot wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:19 pm

Or any remains of Tongham Halt Station.
Indeed! I remember it being there and with track still in situ in the mid 1960s although trains had ceased running long before. Think the bridge was still there until about 25 x years ago!

Oddly enough my Daughter lives in Tongham!
Where did the bridge go from/to?
If it’s the one that I think’s being talked about then it was on the stretch of road that runs from the A331 roundabout up to the Hogs Back (Oxenden Road then becoming The Street). The bridge was just before the parade of shops by Tongham crossroads. Looking down from the bridge, there used to be a GPO/BT storage yard where I recall seeing quite a few surplus red phone boxes.
The bridge has now gone and the road levelled out.

Zippy
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Zippy » Fri Apr 30, 2021 4:08 pm

Tongham Station was here https://goo.gl/maps/vB2RKM7fWi6BbQ9c6 view to the right (towards Aldershot) and the bridge embankment is in the trees on the left. I used to live in Ellison Way and looked into the history of the line a fair bit. There are overhead power cables from the A331/A31 roundabout that go through Tongham and pretty mush follow the route of the line.

When Aldershot was being built there was a line that ran from the Tongham side of Ash Green Halt that went out to Ash and past the Greyhound and then ran roughly parallel to Ash Road and the High Street and terminated around where Burger King is now. It was used to moving the army into the town and only lasted a few years - long gone by about 1860.

Fuggletim
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Fuggletim » Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:27 pm

Statto wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:32 pm
Fuggletim wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:01 pm
lowerbourneshot wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:19 pm

Or any remains of Tongham Halt Station.
Indeed! I remember it being there and with track still in situ in the mid 1960s although trains had ceased running long before. Think the bridge was still there until about 25 x years ago!

Oddly enough my Daughter lives in Tongham!
Where did the bridge go from/to?
The bridge, as others have said, was on "The Street" and was a simple "up and over" with a pedestrian bridge added on one side in later years (a contemporary example of this type of bridge can be seen on the Midhurst Road over the Railway next to Liphook Station.

If you go past the parade of shops, you can see "Bridge Mews" slightly lower down from the level of "The Street" which is roughly where the track alignment was.

Zippy was mentioning another line into Aldershot. I don't think I have heard of this (in nearby Bordon a narrow gauge railway was originally laid to facilitate the moving of the Army into the town which then expanded to become the "Standard" gauge Longmoor Military Railway) , but it may have been the case. Certainly there was a short branch from Tongham which served Aldershot Gas Works. It vanished long, long ago but I seem to recall there was some evidence of an old level crossing on the A323 in the vicinity of the old Bakers Arms pub when I was a kid in the 1960's. Where "Bluff Cove" is in Aldershot now (off Ordnance Road), there were a number of platforms for troop trains which were demolished when the Army married quarters were built.

Some track still exists alongside North Lane and these connected with the mainline between Aldershot and Ash Vale. This spur was known as Government Siding and they were still active up to the late 1980s.

Zippy
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Zippy » Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:40 pm

Fuggletim wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:27 pm
Zippy was mentioning another line into Aldershot. I don't think I have heard of this (in nearby Bordon a narrow gauge railway was originally laid to facilitate the moving of the Army into the town which then expanded to become the "Standard" gauge Longmoor Military Railway) , but it may have been the case. Certainly there was a short branch from Tongham which served Aldershot Gas Works. It vanished long, long ago but I seem to recall there was some evidence of an old level crossing on the A323 in the vicinity of the old Bakers Arms pub when I was a kid in the 1960's. Where "Bluff Cove" is in Aldershot now (off Ordnance Road), there were a number of platforms for troop trains which were demolished when the Army married quarters were built.

Some track still exists alongside North Lane and these connected with the mainline between Aldershot and Ash Vale. This spur was known as Government Siding and they were still active up to the late 1980s.
I wish I could remember where I got that info from, I know it went from Bin Wood near Ash Green Halt then curved up to the A323 and past the Greyhound before going towards Aldershot. It was constructed purely for setting up the camp. It would be around 20 years ago after I moved to Tongham that I looked into this history. A few years back I did walk in the woods off Chester Way and the person showing me round said one of the gate posts from the Gas Works sidings was still there.

I did have photos of the platforms off Ordnance Road from when I worked for the MoD, I remember walking past them going to and from work in the mid to late 1980s as you say :)

Zippy
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Zippy » Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:41 pm

and searching just now about that line, I've just found this which I've never heard of before.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aldershot ... on_railway

Zippy
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Zippy » Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:54 pm

And I've found my source, this book (which I didn't pay anything like £22 for) https://www.amazon.co.uk/Tongham-Railwa ... 0952345803

"The contractor responsible for building much of the new camp at Aldershot......on 15 March 1855........agreed terms with the LSWR to build a temporary line from Tongham to Aldershot in order to speed up construction work. The route for this contractors line went from a trailing junction facing north-east from a point between Tongham and Ash Green station, near Bin Wood, and turned north-west towards Aldershot, running between the present day sites of the Greyhound Inn and the Bricklayers Arms at Ash. From here the line crossed North Lane, south of Thorn Hill, and the ran parallel with the High Street finishing just short of the Farnborough Road. When building was considered to be completed, the contractors line was removed"

Fuggletim
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Fuggletim » Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:07 pm

Interesting bit of info! The line into the Gasworks diverged to the West of Tongham Station. According to everyone's favourite online encyclopaedia, the line into the Gasworks opened in 1898 and closed in 1954. Looking at old maps, I think the line crossed the A323 somewhere in the vicinity of the McDonalds/KFC, so perhaps the alleged remnants of a level crossing by the Bakers Arms had been that very early Military Railway!

Interestingly enough, in Bordon the Hogmoor Inclosure ceased being used by the Army in 2015 and is now a popular open "Green Space." There are still at least 4 x old rails from the old narrow gauge railway laying around, including one where a tree has grown straight through it!

There isn't much evidence of the later standard gauge line left now though.

Zippy
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Zippy » Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:17 pm

Peter Harding says the gasworks branch was opened in 1898 and closed between 1954 and 1960 (it doesn't give the actual date but the line closed then). The bridge in Tongham was demolished in early 1994, there is a photo from then in the book.

I don't know if you've seen the NLS maps website, if not then this link gives you a side-by-side comparison of the level crossing on a map and a current day aerial view. - it puts the crossing outside the self-storage place. The line I mention is older than any of the maps available on NLS. Close the box that comes up on the left and you can wave the cursor around and compare the locations.

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by ... =ESRIWorld
Last edited by Zippy on Sun May 02, 2021 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

Birdman
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Birdman » Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:42 pm

Zippy wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:54 pm
And I've found my source, this book (which I didn't pay anything like £22 for) https://www.amazon.co.uk/Tongham-Railwa ... 0952345803

"The contractor responsible for building much of the new camp at Aldershot......on 15 March 1855........agreed terms with the LSWR to build a temporary line from Tongham to Aldershot in order to speed up construction work. The route for this contractors line went from a trailing junction facing north-east from a point between Tongham and Ash Green station, near Bin Wood, and turned north-west towards Aldershot, running between the present day sites of the Greyhound Inn and the Bricklayers Arms at Ash. From here the line crossed North Lane, south of Thorn Hill, and the ran parallel with the High Street finishing just short of the Farnborough Road. When building was considered to be completed, the contractors line was removed"
I’m reliably informed that author of this book, Peter Harding, is a massive Shots fan, going to home and away games (when the law allows). Good man, Mr H. 👍

sugrues flying headbutt
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by sugrues flying headbutt » Sat May 01, 2021 11:48 am

This is the best O/T thread for ages :mrgreen:

There is still some track and rolling stock at Longmoor, set up on an embankment just west of the FIBUA village. But not somewhere you can wander around as that part is fenced off. Not sure if it came from the Longmoor Military Railway LMR. Obviously you can walk the route of the LMR through the training area and around the ranges.

Fuggletim
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Re: O/t Great British Railway Journeys

Post by Fuggletim » Sat May 01, 2021 12:37 pm

Somebody posted pictures of this old rolling stock at Longmoor on the Bordon Nostalgia page on FB, but deleted it I think.

Almost certainly old LMR stock, but very dilapidated. It has been standing out in the open air for about 50 x years now! Think the LMR closed in about 1969, but all the track etc didn't vanish until about 1972.

One of my earliest memories is being on the old 13A Haslemere to Alton bus crossing the then Whitehill Crossroads with a blue tank engine (Almost certainly a WD Hunslet Saddle Tank) with a couple of coaches puffing along from the Liss direction under the bridge!


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