Southgate

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redblueuptoyou
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Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by redblueuptoyou » Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:57 pm

Bob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:29 pm
The knee thing has made things worse than ever as I said the other day, theirs been more complaints about what’s been said on social media in the last year or so than ever has been
Proves why they need to carry on raising awareness of social injustice and show solidarity with those who experience racism.

Obviously it would be better to do something more concrete - but this is so tough when people refuse to listen (by booing a symbolic action) or acknowledge their privilege.

Aldershot_Rob
Posts: 676
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Location: England
Re: Southgate

Post by Aldershot_Rob » Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:44 pm

Cph.shots wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 2:32 pm
I'd imagine most of the "fans" doing the booing were white and lack a bit of understanding and experiences that minority's have.
Imagine making a sweeping statement like that about black people, or Asians, or anyone for that matter? Get a grip, you're embarrassing yourself.
Everyone of every walk of life can experience injustices, prejudices and have awful experiences.

Do we make a gesture for rape victims? No, but we have rainbows for the LGBTQRzsTUVWzxYz community.
Do we have gestures for those poor women who suffer in the sex slave industry?
Or men , women and children who part of modern day slavery that is happening globally? No but we do have a diversity programme in the work place now.

Please don't patronise and assume that people are any less human because they boo are feeble gesture for equality that was started because the death of a criminal thousands of miles away.

Bob
Posts: 1038
Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2017 10:58 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by Bob » Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:52 pm

All lives matter for Christ sake, absolutely beyond pathetic

Aldershot_Rob
Posts: 676
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Location: England
Re: Southgate

Post by Aldershot_Rob » Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:52 pm

redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:57 pm

Proves why they need to carry on raising awareness of social injustice and show solidarity with those who experience racism.

Obviously it would be better to do something more concrete - but this is so tough when people refuse to listen (by booing a symbolic action) or acknowledge their privilege.
Their privilege? You make out like I only have what I have in my life because of the colour of my skin. The hard work thousands of good honest people of all colour, creed and race . It is no ones privilege, it is a dog eat dog world out there and you're just as likely to get chewed up and spat out these days if you are white than if you were anyother colour or race. Possibly more so now given all the red tape and diversity programmes in place to ensure that every tom dick and Harry from all other backgrounds come before the privileged white boy who came from a council estate , wore hand-me-downs from neighbours because his parents couldn't afford brand new clothes and had to make his own luck in life. But hey, we only get where we get because of our privilege, right? Nothing to do with choosing to better yourself rather than take paths that lead to crime?
Thank god for my privilege :roll:

Bob
Posts: 1038
Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2017 10:58 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by Bob » Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:11 pm

Aldershot_Rob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:52 pm
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:57 pm

Proves why they need to carry on raising awareness of social injustice and show solidarity with those who experience racism.

Obviously it would be better to do something more concrete - but this is so tough when people refuse to listen (by booing a symbolic action) or acknowledge their privilege.
Their privilege? You make out like I only have what I have in my life because of the colour of my skin. The hard work thousands of good honest people of all colour, creed and race . It is no ones privilege, it is a dog eat dog world out there and you're just as likely to get chewed up and spat out these days if you are white than if you were anyother colour or race. Possibly more so now given all the red tape and diversity programmes in place to ensure that every tom dick and Harry from all other backgrounds come before the privileged white boy who came from a council estate , wore hand-me-downs from neighbours because his parents couldn't afford brand new clothes and had to make his own luck in life. But hey, we only get where we get because of our privilege, right? Nothing to do with choosing to better yourself rather than take paths that lead to crime?
Thank god for my privilege :roll:
You won’t win with this bloke I’m afraid, he’s given me more stress than an angry dog 🐶😡

Les Briley
Posts: 344
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:37 pm
Location: Elsbels
Re: Southgate

Post by Les Briley » Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:52 pm

Aldershot_Rob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:52 pm
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:57 pm

Proves why they need to carry on raising awareness of social injustice and show solidarity with those who experience racism.

Obviously it would be better to do something more concrete - but this is so tough when people refuse to listen (by booing a symbolic action) or acknowledge their privilege.
Their privilege? You make out like I only have what I have in my life because of the colour of my skin. The hard work thousands of good honest people of all colour, creed and race . It is no ones privilege, it is a dog eat dog world out there and you're just as likely to get chewed up and spat out these days if you are white than if you were anyother colour or race. Possibly more so now given all the red tape and diversity programmes in place to ensure that every tom dick and Harry from all other backgrounds come before the privileged white boy who came from a council estate , wore hand-me-downs from neighbours because his parents couldn't afford brand new clothes and had to make his own luck in life. But hey, we only get where we get because of our privilege, right? Nothing to do with choosing to better yourself rather than take paths that lead to crime?
Thank god for my privilege :roll:
Well said 👍

redblueuptoyou
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by redblueuptoyou » Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:18 pm

Aldershot_Rob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:52 pm
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:57 pm

Proves why they need to carry on raising awareness of social injustice and show solidarity with those who experience racism.

Obviously it would be better to do something more concrete - but this is so tough when people refuse to listen (by booing a symbolic action) or acknowledge their privilege.
Their privilege? You make out like I only have what I have in my life because of the colour of my skin. The hard work thousands of good honest people of all colour, creed and race . It is no ones privilege, it is a dog eat dog world out there and you're just as likely to get chewed up and spat out these days if you are white than if you were anyother colour or race. Possibly more so now given all the red tape and diversity programmes in place to ensure that every tom dick and Harry from all other backgrounds come before the privileged white boy who came from a council estate , wore hand-me-downs from neighbours because his parents couldn't afford brand new clothes and had to make his own luck in life. But hey, we only get where we get because of our privilege, right? Nothing to do with choosing to better yourself rather than take paths that lead to crime?
Thank god for my privilege :roll:
I’ve not mentioned you in any way, shape or form so not sure why you’ve taken an observation so personally? Also, shocked to read (not from you) my comments cause ‘stress’. Institutional racism exists and the diversity programs you mention are in place to add some balance after decades/centuries of unfair treatment.

Part of this is so that people from ethnic minorities have the chance to be screwed over in the same way as ‘every Tom, Dick and Harry’. It’s that simple. Not sure where the ‘paths that lead to crime’ comment comes from?

Anyway, from tomorrow’s papers, it looks like they will stop the knee gesture and replace it with something less divisive. Maybe holding up an anti-racism banner like Millwall (and QPR I think?) did. Would that be OK with all of you?

Back to the football - disappointed for Trent even though he wouldn’t play that much. Ward-Prowse the replacement?
Last edited by redblueuptoyou on Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

scorp
Posts: 424
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 7:54 pm
Location: England
Re: Southgate

Post by scorp » Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:34 pm

Aldershot_Rob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:52 pm
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:57 pm

Proves why they need to carry on raising awareness of social injustice and show solidarity with those who experience racism.

Obviously it would be better to do something more concrete - but this is so tough when people refuse to listen (by booing a symbolic action) or acknowledge their privilege.
Their privilege? You make out like I only have what I have in my life because of the colour of my skin. The hard work thousands of good honest people of all colour, creed and race . It is no ones privilege, it is a dog eat dog world out there and you're just as likely to get chewed up and spat out these days if you are white than if you were anyother colour or race. Possibly more so now given all the red tape and diversity programmes in place to ensure that every tom dick and Harry from all other backgrounds come before the privileged white boy who came from a council estate , wore hand-me-downs from neighbours because his parents couldn't afford brand new clothes and had to make his own luck in life. But hey, we only get where we get because of our privilege, right? Nothing to do with choosing to better yourself rather than take paths that lead to crime?
Thank god for my privilege :roll:

Me too. Well said.

shots1965
Posts: 876
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 8:16 pm
Location: Oklahoma USA
Re: Southgate

Post by shots1965 » Fri Jun 04, 2021 1:39 am

Aldershot_Rob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:44 pm
Cph.shots wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 2:32 pm
I'd imagine most of the "fans" doing the booing were white and lack a bit of understanding and experiences that minority's have.
Imagine making a sweeping statement like that about black people, or Asians, or anyone for that matter? Get a grip, you're embarrassing yourself.
Everyone of every walk of life can experience injustices, prejudices and have awful experiences.

Do we make a gesture for rape victims? No, but we have rainbows for the LGBTQRzsTUVWzxYz community.
Do we have gestures for those poor women who suffer in the sex slave industry?
Or men , women and children who part of modern day slavery that is happening globally? No but we do have a diversity programme in the work place now.

Please don't patronise and assume that people are any less human because they boo are feeble gesture for equality that was started because the death of a criminal thousands of miles away.
I agree with you 100%, …getting very old and tedious now

There are a lot worse things going on in the world

There are millions of injustices going on right now in this world
I don’t think BLM is anywhere near priority

I’ve been called lots of nasty things in my life…I never ever cried about it
GTF over it

Taking a knee, taking the P more like

I will never knell down and apologize for being white


Just my personal opinion

redblueuptoyou
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by redblueuptoyou » Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:22 am

shots1965 wrote:
Fri Jun 04, 2021 1:39 am
Aldershot_Rob wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:44 pm
Cph.shots wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 2:32 pm
I'd imagine most of the "fans" doing the booing were white and lack a bit of understanding and experiences that minority's have.
Imagine making a sweeping statement like that about black people, or Asians, or anyone for that matter? Get a grip, you're embarrassing yourself.
Everyone of every walk of life can experience injustices, prejudices and have awful experiences.

Do we make a gesture for rape victims? No, but we have rainbows for the LGBTQRzsTUVWzxYz community.
Do we have gestures for those poor women who suffer in the sex slave industry?
Or men , women and children who part of modern day slavery that is happening globally? No but we do have a diversity programme in the work place now.

Please don't patronise and assume that people are any less human because they boo are feeble gesture for equality that was started because the death of a criminal thousands of miles away.
I agree with you 100%, …getting very old and tedious now

There are a lot worse things going on in the world

There are millions of injustices going on right now in this world
I don’t think BLM is anywhere near priority

I’ve been called lots of nasty things in my life…I never ever cried about it
GTF over it

Taking a knee, taking the P more like

I will never knell down and apologize for being white


Just my personal opinion
Definitely other concerns around e.g. climate change will make Covid look like a walk in the park!

No one wants you to apologise for being white. You’re reading something into a symbolic action that doesn’t exist. Maybe people should just let them get on with it or ignore it rather than boo?
Whatever connotations people draw through their own mental gymnastics, it’s been declared an anti-racism gesture by those who are doing it. Or put it another way, people can be neither religious (God Save) or a royalist (Our Queen) but still respect our national anthem. Maybe offer the same respect here?

redblueuptoyou
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by redblueuptoyou » Fri Jun 04, 2021 2:17 pm

You can do a tournament predictor on the UEFA website: https://gaming.uefa.com/en/uefaeuro2020 ... ictor/main

Italy seem to be winners whenever I fill it in!

GetShotDownunder
Posts: 299
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2020 2:29 am
Re: Southgate

Post by GetShotDownunder » Sat Jun 05, 2021 12:09 am

Just fleeting interest from me on the English national team front, like second or third team you may make the effort to watch depending on the major tournament.

Southgate put out a well drilled unit in 2018 but did not play in a way you would expect from an English national team and can see how that would be polarising for many.

To me they looked more likely to progress without relying on individual efforts from star players.

Anyway my apologies lockdown can be boring. :D

bordon shot
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:13 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by bordon shot » Sat Jun 05, 2021 9:36 am

redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:39 pm
Red-n-Blue wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:32 pm
Southgate is starting to get on my tits.

This morning he slammed the fans who booed when the players took the knee, saying they, "don't understand the message."

Tell you what, Gareth, why don't you ask those fans why they're booing, or is understanding a one-way street? Better still, keep your mouth shut and focus on the job of football.
I saw that interview and he didn’t ‘slam’ the fans. He said - in his usual calm and eloquent manner - that he was disappointed as some people are trying to make the action politically motivated when it clearly isn’t (oddly, no one seems to have issues with our national anthem with its religious connotations).

Besides, their actions show there really is still a long way to go to tackle these injustices. Did you see the look of disgust on Trent’s face when it happened? As Saka said in his interview after the match, ‘you’ll have to ask those who booed why they booed’.

Have a read of this: https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/engl ... er-1032896
That’s ok, but don’t get upset about it when you don’t like the answer given. If footballers want to do this at every game, then the fans have the right to express their opinion of disagreement.

We are just about hanging on to democracy in this country which gives people the right to voice their opinions.

The reason fans are booing is not that they are racists, but that they dislike this accusation being thrown in their faces. Let’s look at it for what it is, that it is seen as support for a left wing Marxist group of anarchists who want to defund the police & wipe out British history..That is the reason they boo.

redblueuptoyou
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by redblueuptoyou » Sat Jun 05, 2021 10:03 am

bordon shot wrote:
Sat Jun 05, 2021 9:36 am
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:39 pm
Red-n-Blue wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:32 pm
Southgate is starting to get on my tits.

This morning he slammed the fans who booed when the players took the knee, saying they, "don't understand the message."

Tell you what, Gareth, why don't you ask those fans why they're booing, or is understanding a one-way street? Better still, keep your mouth shut and focus on the job of football.
I saw that interview and he didn’t ‘slam’ the fans. He said - in his usual calm and eloquent manner - that he was disappointed as some people are trying to make the action politically motivated when it clearly isn’t (oddly, no one seems to have issues with our national anthem with its religious connotations).

Besides, their actions show there really is still a long way to go to tackle these injustices. Did you see the look of disgust on Trent’s face when it happened? As Saka said in his interview after the match, ‘you’ll have to ask those who booed why they booed’.

Have a read of this: https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/engl ... er-1032896
That’s ok, but don’t get upset about it when you don’t like the answer given. If footballers want to do this at every game, then the fans have the right to express their opinion of disagreement.

We are just about hanging on to democracy in this country which gives people the right to voice their opinions.

The reason fans are booing is not that they are racists, but that they dislike this accusation being thrown in their faces. Let’s look at it for what it is, that it is seen as support for a left wing Marxist group of anarchists who want to defund the police & wipe out British history..That is the reason they boo.
This country has a major Conservative majority government - and has had for the majority of the past 50 years. I don’t think you have anything to worry about regarding ‘a left wing Marxist group of anarchists’? Even if you did, are they not allowed an opinion? Odd democracy. I’m also surprised so many people now have an interest in Marxism - especially these footballers. I’m interested to read Raheem Sterling’s views on it if you can point me in the right direction?

Let’s look at what it is, that it is seen (and described by those doing it) as an anti-racism gesture to raise awareness of social injustice. That’s the reason they do it.

bordon shot
Posts: 444
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:13 pm
Re: Southgate

Post by bordon shot » Sat Jun 05, 2021 12:18 pm

redblueuptoyou wrote:
Sat Jun 05, 2021 10:03 am
bordon shot wrote:
Sat Jun 05, 2021 9:36 am
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:39 pm


I saw that interview and he didn’t ‘slam’ the fans. He said - in his usual calm and eloquent manner - that he was disappointed as some people are trying to make the action politically motivated when it clearly isn’t (oddly, no one seems to have issues with our national anthem with its religious connotations).

Besides, their actions show there really is still a long way to go to tackle these injustices. Did you see the look of disgust on Trent’s face when it happened? As Saka said in his interview after the match, ‘you’ll have to ask those who booed why they booed’.

Have a read of this: https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/engl ... er-1032896
That’s ok, but don’t get upset about it when you don’t like the answer given. If footballers want to do this at every game, then the fans have the right to express their opinion of disagreement.

We are just about hanging on to democracy in this country which gives people the right to voice their opinions.

The reason fans are booing is not that they are racists, but that they dislike this accusation being thrown in their faces. Let’s look at it for what it is, that it is seen as support for a left wing Marxist group of anarchists who want to defund the police & wipe out British history..That is the reason they boo.
This country has a major Conservative majority government - and has had for the majority of the past 50 years. I don’t think you have anything to worry about regarding ‘a left wing Marxist group of anarchists’? Even if you did, are they not allowed an opinion? Odd democracy. I’m also surprised so many people now have an interest in Marxism - especially these footballers. I’m interested to read Raheem Sterling’s views on it if you can point me in the right direction?

Let’s look at what it is, that it is seen (and described by those doing it) as an anti-racism gesture to raise awareness of social injustice. That’s the reason they do it.

Of course they are allowed an opinion, but the point I was making (which you are choosing to ignore) is that people have different opinions about what they are supposedly supporting. What we are witnessing now that fans are allowed back into stadiums, is this difference of opinion . They have had to remain quiet, while these pampered, over-paid footballers were allowed to get on with their virtue signalling. True to form, the shouty lefties, start to smear these people who have a different view, of being racist.

For what it’s worth, my opinion is that I think kneeling is a pointless gesture as it it sends out the wrong message. I would rather see players all gather around the centre circle all joined together with arms over their shoulders. Maybe that message would get applauded by fans .

Whether you like it or not, going down on the knee is seen as a submissive gesture of support to a Marxist group. Saying that it to raise awareness of social injustice is a pretty poor excuse.


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