POLITICS

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IanShots
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:12 pm
Re: POLITICS

Post by IanShots » Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:30 pm

Agree with every point there Richard, I thought they should have gone for Lisa Nandy at the time which would have looked a new fresh approach!

Starmer is currently doing a Cameron in the way that he is managing the many years up to the next election. Cameron barely mentioned a policy for years until we got close to the 2010 election, Starmer is doing the same and it is infuriating. He might be a great PM if he actually got there, he is after all a self made man, very intelligent and in simple terms know as how to run things! I could rip the current cabinet apart on those three elements.

chimpster99
Posts: 603
Joined: Thu May 17, 2007 6:54 am
Location: Alton
Re: POLITICS

Post by chimpster99 » Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:33 pm

[quote=Fuggletim post_id=666144 time=1626778029 user_id=5150]
That said, shortsightedness was endemic to his report, and I am sure we can all think of railway routes that should never of closed (Locally the Mid Hants between Alton through to Winchester springs to mind) but it has to be remembered that cuts started long before Beeching.
[/quote]

The Mid Hants (Watercress Line) have a project looking to restore passenger services alongside steam, the idea being that every 2nd or 3rd train would go beyond Alton to Alresford. The initiative is being supported by developers building in Four Marks, Ropley and Alresford.

Sadly they can't take it any further as the old track bed has been built over in the western part of Alresford as well as Itchen Abbas and King's Worthy.

Reg's corner
Posts: 275
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 12:37 pm
Re: POLITICS

Post by Reg's corner » Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:33 pm

Looking at klansburgs history it is easy to see why people are suspicious of her, her motives and her connections. I always find it fascinating she gets the 'scoop'.. Before anyone else and puts her spin on it.. Other news outlets have completely different views and interpretations.. My advice is :ignore klansburg, as I now do.

Mytshot
Posts: 406
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:25 pm
Location: Mytchett
Re: POLITICS

Post by Mytshot » Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm

Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:40 pm
lanternhall wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:41 am
redblueuptoyou wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 9:50 am


Well, he has the messages (which have been verified). Nothing seems to touch Johnson though…
That is because we don't have a credible opposition and I say this as a life long Labour supporter
I agree completely with you, the lack of a credible opposition is a disaster for our politics at the moment and I say that as a lifelong Conservative supporter.

A strong opposition is vital to keep a government accountable and a smaller majority in the house is also better as it means that backbenchers within the governing party who maybe have concerns about government policy have more power to have their concerns addressed by threatening to vote against any such policy.
I don't buy this 'there is no credible opposition' argument: I mean, Labour (or any other opposition party) is a worse alternative than this...?
Patel's ignored bullying inquiry
Williamson's exam fiasco
Jenrick's dodgy planning approval
Cummings defended for 'testing his eyesight'
Hancock and Gove's unlawful awarding of pandemic contracts
Hancock's affair
Patel's detention policies breaching human rights
Lack of PPE
The care home scandal
Too late to lockdown
Flip flopping mixed messaging of Covid regulations
Johnson's dodgy flat decoration
Johnson and Sunak trying to avoid self isolation
Johnson lying about the Northern Ireland border
Gove magically dodging self isolation by getting onto a 'pilot' scheme

And that's off the top of my head! How bad do they have to get?

Richard Petty
Posts: 1342
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:12 pm
Location: Farnborough
Re: POLITICS

Post by Richard Petty » Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm

WTF wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:28 pm
Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:58 pm
Fuggletim wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 1:32 pm
Well can't say too much about the IOW trains as I have been involved with the project, but there are many factors in the delays!

It would be good to see a rail link back to Newport. A lot of the trackbed still does exist, although some key parts have now gone. I am glad though the idea is being looked at seriously!

Another route looked at is restoring the link from Shanklin to Ventnor which again has a significant part of the trackbed intact, but also again a few key parts (like at Wroxhall) which has been built over. Crucially though, Ventnor Tunnel is still there and ironically is probably busier now than it ever was, because although it no longer carries train, it carries various utilities into the town like water and gas.

I did have the pleasure of travelling to Ventnor on the train when I was a kid and I think that must have been about 1965/1966 as we went over on the new fangled "Hovercraft" to Ryde!
Is there any room either side of where the old line has been built over to add a new section as the line from Shanklin to Ventnor would probably be very popular.
From my friend on the island Richard, most of the line to Ventnor is still there but a bridge would need to be built from Shanklin station over the main road.
Thanks WTF, It would be nice if it could happen

Richard Petty
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Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:12 pm
Location: Farnborough
Re: POLITICS

Post by Richard Petty » Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:43 pm

Reg's corner wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:33 pm
Looking at klansburgs history it is easy to see why people are suspicious of her, her motives and her connections. I always find it fascinating she gets the 'scoop'.. Before anyone else and puts her spin on it.. Other news outlets have completely different views and interpretations.. My advice is :ignore klansburg, as I now do.
Being Political Editor for the BBC will get her access to news long before others because she is the one that political parties want to put the story out so will give her early exclusives. Political editors always have held a lot of power because they can even in this day and age of social media make or break a politician. Robert Peston was a a perfect example of that were many blamed him (perhaps a bit unfairly) for the banks crashing back in 2008. He was particularly culpable for the rush on Northern Rock Bank.

Some may not like the way that Laura Kuensburg delivers her "Scoops" and I accept that maybe now and then she has put a bit of her own spin on something but I do trust the accuracy of her stories as she is known within the news circles for ensuring she can corroborate her facts.
Last edited by Richard Petty on Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

lanternhall
Posts: 1230
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2015 1:37 am
Re: POLITICS

Post by lanternhall » Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:03 pm

Mytshot wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm
Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:40 pm
lanternhall wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:41 am


That is because we don't have a credible opposition and I say this as a life long Labour supporter
I agree completely with you, the lack of a credible opposition is a disaster for our politics at the moment and I say that as a lifelong Conservative supporter.

A strong opposition is vital to keep a government accountable and a smaller majority in the house is also better as it means that backbenchers within the governing party who maybe have concerns about government policy have more power to have their concerns addressed by threatening to vote against any such policy.
I don't buy this 'there is no credible opposition' argument: I mean, Labour (or any other opposition party) is a worse alternative than this...?

But we are not. Labour should be miles ahead in opinion polls now. They are not. The Tories are. What does that say about us?

You are right. Labour should be way ahead in the opinion polls now. They are not. The Tories are. What does that say?
Patel's ignored bullying inquiry
Williamson's exam fiasco
Jenrick's dodgy planning approval
Cummings defended for 'testing his eyesight'
Hancock and Gove's unlawful awarding of pandemic contracts
Hancock's affair
Patel's detention policies breaching human rights
Lack of PPE
The care home scandal
Too late to lockdown
Flip flopping mixed messaging of Covid regulations
Johnson's dodgy flat decoration
Johnson and Sunak trying to avoid self isolation
Johnson lying about the Northern Ireland border
Gove magically dodging self isolation by getting onto a 'pilot' scheme

And that's off the top of my head! How bad do they have to get?

redblueuptoyou
Posts: 1159
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: POLITICS

Post by redblueuptoyou » Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:24 pm

Mytshot wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm
Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:40 pm
lanternhall wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:41 am


That is because we don't have a credible opposition and I say this as a life long Labour supporter
I agree completely with you, the lack of a credible opposition is a disaster for our politics at the moment and I say that as a lifelong Conservative supporter.

A strong opposition is vital to keep a government accountable and a smaller majority in the house is also better as it means that backbenchers within the governing party who maybe have concerns about government policy have more power to have their concerns addressed by threatening to vote against any such policy.
I don't buy this 'there is no credible opposition' argument: I mean, Labour (or any other opposition party) is a worse alternative than this...?
Patel's ignored bullying inquiry
Williamson's exam fiasco
Jenrick's dodgy planning approval
Cummings defended for 'testing his eyesight'
Hancock and Gove's unlawful awarding of pandemic contracts
Hancock's affair
Patel's detention policies breaching human rights
Lack of PPE
The care home scandal
Too late to lockdown
Flip flopping mixed messaging of Covid regulations
Johnson's dodgy flat decoration
Johnson and Sunak trying to avoid self isolation
Johnson lying about the Northern Ireland border
Gove magically dodging self isolation by getting onto a 'pilot' scheme

And that's off the top of my head! How bad do they have to get?
Breaking international law ‘in a limited and specific way’.
Planning to starve kids during a pandemic.
2,200 food banks in the UK.

And this is the latest: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... hange.html

bordon shot
Posts: 488
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:13 pm
Re: POLITICS

Post by bordon shot » Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:30 pm

Mytshot wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm
Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:40 pm
lanternhall wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:41 am


That is because we don't have a credible opposition and I say this as a life long Labour supporter
I agree completely with you, the lack of a credible opposition is a disaster for our politics at the moment and I say that as a lifelong Conservative supporter.

A strong opposition is vital to keep a government accountable and a smaller majority in the house is also better as it means that backbenchers within the governing party who maybe have concerns about government policy have more power to have their concerns addressed by threatening to vote against any such policy.
I don't buy this 'there is no credible opposition' argument: I mean, Labour (or any other opposition party) is a worse alternative than this...?
Patel's ignored bullying inquiry
Williamson's exam fiasco
Jenrick's dodgy planning approval
Cummings defended for 'testing his eyesight'
Hancock and Gove's unlawful awarding of pandemic contracts
Hancock's affair
Patel's detention policies breaching human rights
Lack of PPE
The care home scandal
Too late to lockdown
Flip flopping mixed messaging of Covid regulations
Johnson's dodgy flat decoration
Johnson and Sunak trying to avoid self isolation
Johnson lying about the Northern Ireland border
Gove magically dodging self isolation by getting onto a 'pilot' scheme

And that's off the top of my head! How bad do they have to get?
And yet still they are a long way ahead of Labour, if the opinion polls are to be believed. IMO, Labour lost their soul quite a while ago. They were formed as a party for the working class, then the posh socialists infiltrated the party & they lost the very principles that they stood for.

The nail in their coffin will be their stance over Brexit, completely ignored the working class & campaigned the 2019 GE on overturning a democratic decision.

Mytshot
Posts: 406
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:25 pm
Location: Mytchett
Re: POLITICS

Post by Mytshot » Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:45 pm

bordon shot wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:30 pm

And yet still they are a long way ahead of Labour, if the opinion polls are to be believed. IMO, Labour lost their soul quite a while ago. They were formed as a party for the working class, then the posh socialists infiltrated the party & they lost the very principles that they stood for.

The nail in their coffin will be their stance over Brexit, completely ignored the working class & campaigned the 2019 GE on overturning a democratic decision.
And I think you have confirmed my theory that Johnson is seen as a protector of Brexit and as such he can do whatever he wants. Lies and corruption are a price worth paying to many.

WTF
Posts: 859
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:17 am
Re: POLITICS

Post by WTF » Tue Jul 20, 2021 8:10 pm

Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm
WTF wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:28 pm
Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:58 pm


Is there any room either side of where the old line has been built over to add a new section as the line from Shanklin to Ventnor would probably be very popular.
From my friend on the island Richard, most of the line to Ventnor is still there but a bridge would need to be built from Shanklin station over the main road.
Thanks WTF, It would be nice if it could happen
I will see what info I can get. I think from what he says the proposed Sandown to Newport will happen first, if it does!

hepcat
Posts: 270
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:50 pm
Re: POLITICS

Post by hepcat » Tue Jul 20, 2021 8:24 pm

Mytshot wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:34 pm
Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:40 pm
lanternhall wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:41 am


That is because we don't have a credible opposition and I say this as a life long Labour supporter
I agree completely with you, the lack of a credible opposition is a disaster for our politics at the moment and I say that as a lifelong Conservative supporter.

A strong opposition is vital to keep a government accountable and a smaller majority in the house is also better as it means that backbenchers within the governing party who maybe have concerns about government policy have more power to have their concerns addressed by threatening to vote against any such policy.
I don't buy this 'there is no credible opposition' argument: I mean, Labour (or any other opposition party) is a worse alternative than this...?
Patel's ignored bullying inquiry
Williamson's exam fiasco
Jenrick's dodgy planning approval
Cummings defended for 'testing his eyesight'
Hancock and Gove's unlawful awarding of pandemic contracts
Hancock's affair
Patel's detention policies breaching human rights
Lack of PPE
The care home scandal
Too late to lockdown
Flip flopping mixed messaging of Covid regulations
Johnson's dodgy flat decoration
Johnson and Sunak trying to avoid self isolation
Johnson lying about the Northern Ireland border
Gove magically dodging self isolation by getting onto a 'pilot' scheme

And that's off the top of my head! How bad do they have to get?
All true, but are you making the fundamental error of thinking Labour/Lib Dems/SNP are as pure as the driven snow ? Things are ALLOWED to get as bad as this as each side (Left and Right) foam at the mouth when "The other lot" do the crime yet go all selectively deaf and blind when their party does exactly the same, Hence we never get beyond t6he self righteous indignations. and total denials and conspiracy theories as excuses for ignoring what your party of choice does wrong. Until we get beyond the infantile party politics mantra and start condemning anyone wearing any silly coloured rosette for doing the crime we are stuck with what we've got, To quote McKay from "Porridge" -and referring to all politicians "I hold them all in equal contempt". Beyond Jack Ashley it is very hard to name any decent worthy MP of any denomination from the last 50 years, Self serving charlatan's and hypocrites all.

redblueuptoyou
Posts: 1159
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 1:52 pm
Re: POLITICS

Post by redblueuptoyou » Tue Jul 20, 2021 8:42 pm

Hepcat - I think you’re being unfair on Ken Clarke.

Also don’t remember this level of behaviour under previous governments (all colours). Hancock’s affair was a bit of a throwback to what used to be seen as a scandal…

Did anyone watch the interview? I read someone earlier describe Cummings as an ‘agent of chaos’ who just wants to mess things up and show it can be done. No doubt this stuff should be out in the public domain but they have a point.

Somerset Shot
Posts: 247
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 10:49 pm
Location: Somerset
Re: POLITICS

Post by Somerset Shot » Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:53 pm

Bob wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:21 pm
MANNIMIST wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:38 pm
Off you go then lads - start debating.
I’d rather discuss how wasps operate in Peru 🇵🇪 to be honest MR Mist!
Ah yes, that would be interesting. Peru has the wasp with the world’s most painful sting I believe. 🐝

lowerbourneshot
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:29 pm
Location: The Ex Legion now Lower Bourne Social Club
Re: POLITICS

Post by lowerbourneshot » Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:56 pm

Richard Petty wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:58 pm
Fuggletim wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 1:32 pm
Well can't say too much about the IOW trains as I have been involved with the project, but there are many factors in the delays!

It would be good to see a rail link back to Newport. A lot of the trackbed still does exist, although some key parts have now gone. I am glad though the idea is being looked at seriously!

Another route looked at is restoring the link from Shanklin to Ventnor which again has a significant part of the trackbed intact, but also again a few key parts (like at Wroxhall) which has been built over. Crucially though, Ventnor Tunnel is still there and ironically is probably busier now than it ever was, because although it no longer carries train, it carries various utilities into the town like water and gas.

I did have the pleasure of travelling to Ventnor on the train when I was a kid and I think that must have been about 1965/1966 as we went over on the new fangled "Hovercraft" to Ryde!
Is there any room either side of where the old line has been built over to add a new section as the line from Shanklin to Ventnor would probably be very popular.
The footpath of the old track is still there between Shanklin to Wroxall, but Wroxall station is an industrial estate now . A village very dear to my heart Wroxall.


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